Ep 153: From Being Told to “SHUT UP” to RM 150+ million in 5 years?! | Hui Jing Lee, Co-Founder of Bila-Bila Mart

Ling Yah: Hi STIMIES! Welcome to the So This Is My Why podcast, where we explore the lives of inspiring people, understanding how they found their why and turned that into reality so you can do the same.
Now today we have Hui Jing Lee, the co-founder of Bila-Bila Mart, a revolutionary grocery chain that's reshaping Malaysia's retail landscape in Klang Valley.
Ling Yah: From motor spots racing to navigating family debt where she was held hostage to competing in a 1000 kilometer motor sports endurance race to working at a Mac D store.
Risk is something that should be Hui Jing's middle name.​
In this interview, we dive deep into how she went from a very high paying position at British American Tobacco to self-employment as an insurance agent and how an event spurred her to launch her own grocery chain, .
Just before we begin, a special shout out to Bila-Bila Mart for sponsoring this episode.
Their support has allowed us to continue bringing inspiring stories just like Hui Jing's.
Ling Yah: I wonder, Hui Jing, when was the last time you lied to yourself?
Hui Jing Lee: Mm, I don't really remember. As we age, I think we just become more and more honest about
our feelings. So I was just telling my husband, today is just not the day. Last time I would just lie to myself. I can do it.
Now I would just tell him I need to go for some bath or sound healing. I need to sleep in. So sometimes I will come in late office 'cause it is just not feeling it.
Go for a lunchtime Pilates so that I get the endorphins in my body and just release out the negative energy and exchange to better energy because we know that we are very huge influence in the entire company.
Ling Yah: I imagine the process to get there must have been quite hard. It didn't feel like you were that person when you were young.
You were very gung ho.
Hui Jing Lee: Yes. But it's like all, I think a facade. I think because I grow up not having you know what it is, it's hard growing up. And I go to schools with a lot of rich people, like good school, the quarantine, the Catholic high school. So like when you're a teenager, you're always trying to fit in, like trying to a bit Yeah.
Lie to yourself that, I am like this, I just fit into where I am. So growing up, the self-esteem is actually very low.
Ling Yah: Yeah.
Hui Jing Lee: Yeah. So, but now I've been, I'm able to face it and embrace my background
because that makes me who I am.
Ling Yah: But fitting in must have been hard with all these rich people when your family went into debt.
Hui Jing Lee: I read that your parents were even held hostage.
Yeah.
Ling Yah: Which sounds like from a TV B drama.
Hui Jing Lee: Yeah, it is. So it is. That's why I didn't wanna talk about it because my mother is also a prominent figure in in school. So growing up she'll just say that, okay, you make sure that you don't tell your friends about it.
It's not something to be proud of. You know how typical Chinese family will say that. So just a lot of suppression. The only person who know is my brother. So I'm very close with my brother who is two years younger. 'cause we are the one that really went through everything together. We know what's happening.
So yeah, it is extremely hard feeling. And I'll tell you this, every time I come back from a friend's birthday party, 'cause you go to the nice house, then I go home, I resent my mom. Like, why do you marry my father? Yes. But after today, I still feel bad about it. That, you know, I felt that because she tried so hard.
She really, really tried very hard. Like we'll question her like, why didn't you bring me to kopitiam right after church? Why didn't you bring me to kopitiam when everybody's there Now I see it. She's really just trying to save every single penny. And every time after like teachers day or like children's day, you have a lot of leftover party food, then she'll be the one that, the embarrassing parent that will tapau everything.
Yeah. Say, oh my God, it's so embarrassing.
But at home we enjoy eating those are like, you know, western indulgent, like it's salad pasta whatsoever. Then looking back Yes. Is really just, if she can save RM1, she will save it.
Ling Yah: Yeah. I imagine that perspective has changed. 'cause you're also a mom as well, right?
Mm-hmm. And yeah. That's to appreciate,
Hui Jing Lee: correct, correct,
Ling Yah: correct. So everything
Hui Jing Lee: is for the children.
Ling Yah: So you said you were very close to your brother, your sister wasn't around going through this tough time year. Yeah. What do you wish she knew about that time? I
Hui Jing Lee: actually don't want her to go through what I've been through 'cause it's very hard.
Right.
Ling Yah: It feel like it set you up for your life though. When I'm speaking to Venon of ZEUS, one of the qualities he says that allowed him to succeed was hunger. And that hunger came 'cause he didn't come from a well to do family. He had to fight so for himself. And that was what allowed him to be where he is today.
And he compare all his rich friends. We just have everything laid out for them. Yeah. Yeah. So,
Hui Jing Lee: I don't think it's so much of like the material, but rather the entire wellbeing, like the mentality where I cannot tell anybody. I think what I've been through, you can be poor, but if your family is happy, your parents are happily married, it is still fine.
But my father not only have bad debts, he also have mistress. So that's like double whammy. That's worse. Yeah. So that's also what my mom say. I mean, you can be poor, but don't be poor in dignity. But my dad just lost it also. I have can see almost zero respect for him.
Ling Yah: And so you decided I need to stand up for myself, make my own way in this world.
Mm. You did so many things when you were 15 years old. Yeah. Working. I did not even the legal working age yet. Yeah,
Hui Jing Lee: yeah, yeah.
Ling Yah: Your first job was RM4 an hour.
Hui Jing Lee: Yeah.
Ling Yah: What was it like entering the workforce so young?
Hui Jing Lee: It was okay. The first one was just really traumatized because nobody wants to hire me.
So the one that will hire me will be those employer that goes against the rules. So imagine how she will treat me.
They will not be very empathetic. To them. It's like, okay, I want you to work 12 hours, 13 hours means you must work.
And for it there's no OT, ah. RM4 an hour. That's quite expensive. But I was desperate 'cause I really walked the entire mall. So even now, if you close my eyes, I can walk the Mid Valley just blindfolded.
Ling Yah: So you literally knocked on every door and said...
Hui Jing Lee: I knocked on every door.
But I was not very confident to knock on Starbucks or like the likes of barista. 'Cause again, I think it's a self-esteem issue that I just didn't realize.
So I go to brands which are not well known. So that boutique that hire me is also not a well-known brand, but it's still there after so many years.
I started going to Mid Valley, 11 years old. That when the malls just opened, it was I think 1999.
So that's why I know the mall inside out exactly. Nooks and crannies who is.
It's a very good experience, even though it's not a good one, because then, the employee is also very stereotypical, like, okay, everybody will come in. You need to look at how they dressed, and you have to look like a thief. You have to follow them. That's what I've been taught. But of course I'm my own wisdom. I say, why do you do that? You cannot stereotype people.
And it's so disrespectful. Yeah. But now I understand. So when every someone tell you means they probably suspect that you'll steal something.
Not only that, I mean then I say, okay, so how about my uniform? You say, oh, you just take anything you like, just pick.
Then after that, do I need to bring it back and wash it? And then you just put it back into the plastic bag.
that was
Ling Yah: my first working speech, taking away the potential candidates right now. Yeah.
Hui Jing Lee: But, but that place is still there and it's still the same supervisor. I always just avoid every time I pass by.
Ling Yah: Yeah. Yeah. Were you actively looking for other work as well? 'cause
Hui Jing Lee: you did so many things. No I didn't. I didn't because it was during school holidays. It was quite a tiring one and a half month working with her. I just dread going to work and I swear I'm not going, going to go back. For sure. Not going to go back.
Ling Yah: So how did on this McDonald's or waiter. Motor sports?
Hui Jing Lee: So okay, so McDonald's then all became a ritual. So every school holidays I will work and gain some money. So McDonald's is one of the most fun one. Oh, the culture is great. So I think it's
not about how hard the work is. 'cause McDonald's is is not easy.
Yeah. 'Cause it's hot. The work in the kitchen. The worst is really cleaning up dirty tables. Really? That's the worst because then you can see different behavioral human beings, right.
There are some people who are very nice, they will keep everything and even throw the rubbish for you. But they will be jakuns that would put chili sauce on a tray.
He put underneath the handle so that whoever that cleans it. Oh, that's horrible. Yeah. That's horrible. So you can see various kind of human behavior.
But I actually enjoy McDonald's a lot. The supervisor really treat me like a human. Because I think he also know that people who come and work part-time is not rich.
They're not supposed to, but every food that is at the end of the day, that's just unsold has to be thrown into the rubbish bin. The only person that can take it is the store managerial supervisor. He'll always just pass me a burger.
Oh, that's
nice. Yeah, it's very, very nice. And then when the car series for the Happy Meal came out, he gave me like a full set when everywhere has sold out.
I really appreciate that. So that was a very Malay centric culture, which I really enjoy.
Then after that I went to Body shop. Body Shop itself was also cutthroat because every single salesperson had individual commission and very good at customer service.
So I didn't notice that, you know, my sale, why are the seniors fighting? Oh, Jing's sales is mine. Oh. Then I realize, ah, because you have a commission. And so then I will use that and I'll just pass a commission to the manager that treats me well or the sales person that treats me well. So you don't get any commission?
I don't because I was part-timer, but pay was very good. It was RM10/hour, and during Christmas and New Year's Eve, it is triple. So imagine. Oh, that's very good. 30 bucks for, I think year 2001. That is Oh wow. A lot.
Ling Yah: So how were you picking all these different roles?
It was, was it just for money? Whatever?
Hui Jing Lee: Yeah. Yeah, it was for money. It was really for money. I think McDonald's was just by chance. Hey, it looks fine. Yeah, let's go to F&B. Okay. I tried boutique, don't wanna go back to boutique. Let's try F&B. And then I, again, I was also not having the confidence to go to Starbucks.
I dunno why I just didn't start footage to Starbucks. I just didn't ask. It's a self-esteem issue. Yeah. 'cause you had body shop. All right. It's a self-esteem issue. Then. Body shop, pay 10 bucks. Okay, fine. Just go to the body shop. Yeah. And it was amazing. I, it is a different experience because from a 30 kitchen, you're now working in fragrances.
And then people buy gifts. You learn how to wrap gifts, small little things like that. But ultimately it's all the human behaviors that you picked up at the end of the day.
Ling Yah: I can see us how you were honing your sales skills. We gonna help you later. Right. BAT and everything else. Correct. What were some of the tricks you learned to make a good self?
Hui Jing Lee: I, I still haven't learned yet. Oh. Honestly, I only learned the hard way when I was in BAT.
Because I've always been someone who I can say like, my mother really have no time to teach me. And my father is non-existent. So a lot of these things I learned by myself. So growing up I've always been very blunt, very straightforward, and many times just being told off and politically unaware.
So like, go back to motorsports. That one I really wanna touch is because I can see like how quota system actually works. So my time yes, there is a driver search, right. It's all a marketing gimmick. They just wanna get a bunch of girls because female make an interesting story. Female motorsport, how rare is that?
And when I entered I was shortlisted, but the year after I was being handpicked to be one of the finalist. But they already have their own list of people. I was being managed to be the substitute. And then I didn't proceed because it was a joint campaign with Brunei. So they need four drivers.
Definitely. They would choose two Bruneians and goes saying, and then there were two Chinese and then one Ali. So I wasn't the coolest one because the other person was she's a female, she's a makeup artist, and she's also a workshop mechanic. Oh, good story. Good story to tell. So that makes me understand.
Okay. There's a reason behind everything. There's no fairness in this world. Yeah, really? So I, I accepted that after a few years. I couldn't accept it on that point because if we are on the equal skill sets, why did, why didn't you pick me? Because I'm a nobody. I have no story to tell. I was just a student.
Yeah.
Ling Yah: Did you feel that? 'cause I'm a nobody. I need to make myself as somebody. Did you feel that? I've always thought of it like that. So that's why always write so very, very competitive since young.
Did you have an idea what that somebody would look like? What role?
Hui Jing Lee: That No,
I just need to have power.
Just need to be a leader. Someone to call the shots.
Doing accountancy doesn't give you power. Doesn't gimme power. So what happened there?
So halfway through, I changed major. 'cause the first semester itself, I know this is not for me really. I changed major, so I was accounting as the main major and I took marketing instead of finance.
Ling Yah: Yeah. '
Hui Jing Lee: cause I really didn't like it. I went to a finance class, I said, no, this is not for me. So I went to marketing. So it was a very weird degree. It was accounting and marketing.
Ling Yah: So you weren't worried and thinking, oh my gosh, maybe I'm the kind of person who just can't settle and figure out what I like.
Some people have that fear of quitting anything. Right. It doesn't seem like you suffer from that.
Hui Jing Lee: Mm, I don't because I will just I, I hardly just give up halfway. So I would just praise it to regardless. I just have to see the end of it. Yeah. Yeah. So for BAT I think how I got in was true like they were last time
I used to be very active in like, universities career fairs and there was a competition. It was also because of the cash price.
So I thought, okay, this competition is cash, price must join.
So I joined and then it was a very different business case study competition compared to the one that I also joined was under L'Oreal. L'Oreal was just business plan, business proposal. A lot to do with the thinking. But what I didn't expect from BAT was just a day two.
I thought it ends here. How come it is a day two? So it came by a surprise to say that, okay, now you have already have your business proposal. Your proposal right now, you have to make it come true. That came by a surprise. We didn't expect that. So it was about a rebranding of a snack brand, right?
Whether you want to go for a rebranding or repositioning. So whatever business case that we did, we have to activate it inside my pyramid. So we were selling snacks. Oh my gosh. Doing random campaigns as a student. So that was a surprise to all of us. But I think of BAT going, you're making us do free work Nola, it's not BT cell seekers.
Yeah. So daily I was snack. Yeah. Yeah. So it's, it's just it's a very interesting business plan competition.
Ling Yah: Why sticker out with BAT? You said before it goes against your values, you don't have a smoke money law.
Hui Jing Lee: Yeah. Yeah. Fair enough. I think, again, it all comes back to money. We were look all looking at what are the management trainees program that pays the best we bank.
Okay. No banking. So it was down to FMCG. I know that I wanted to do FMCG, just which one? Right then L'Oreal, then of course you heard that okay, it can be a bit political. BATI don't, I'm not sure, but they were one of the highest paying for mainstream trainee. So, and then because through the competition, I actually got a fast pass, which mean I don't have to go through all the interviews.
I just need to see the directors.
Ling Yah: Yeah,
Hui Jing Lee: yeah. Whether I get hired or not is then up to the director. Yeah. So in the end of course, then thank God I get, hi, I got hired, so I Google was trainee.
Ling Yah: Yeah. Google, I think pay was five. Five. For management trainee or
Hui Jing Lee: Now, now during my time it was three five as a start.
First year, two years program. Second year is a 1000 increment. Okay. Pretty good. Depending on your performance. So they are like, if you are, if you over perform, you actually get even more. Yeah. Yeah. And there was a lot of politics after on BAT. Yes. But the culture was still very good. Mm-hmm. And BAT give me a, a pace to build.
The culture that I have today.
Ling Yah: How so? Like,
Hui Jing Lee: There are a few values that are always spring with me. Like embrace diversity, further diversity to race, diversity to gender. I really see them not just talking about it, they also practice it because it's a such a male dominated industry. I've never felt that I get discriminated.
One of my roles that I have was an area manager, so I'm supposed to be in sales, right? And I'm handling distributor salesmen about almost hundreds of them. Malay man, right. And then I have also my executive, which are mixture of races, mainly men only me and another exec, which are female.
You don't count my pa and you don't count our secretarial admins. So there's total five female in the office out of a group of a hundred women. I never felt discriminated. They always appreciate my voice. I just find that pretty amazing. I didn't know how sheltered I was until I left BAT.
Then I realized, oh my, this company really value and they just don't talk like they really practice it. Yeah. Embrace diversity, freedom to responsibility. They don't micromanage me.
So what I learned is from one of my, the manager that I worked with, she always ask everything that you do, you need to understand what's the objective.
As long as you understand the reason why you're doing it, you'll be able to excel. So she give us a lot of trust, like a lot of wisdom. So a lot of my leadership style is also through her. Yeah. She's amazing. And she's a workaholic. Yeah. She sleeps in the office.
Ling Yah: Yeah. What were some of the examples of leadership that she's displayed that you try
Hui Jing Lee: to do as well?
I think the first thing that was really how you analyze numbers.
All of us grow up listening to stories, right? Kids like storybooks. As an adult, you like to go to the movies, right? If you look at number, you look at the Excel.
Excel sheet is not just numbers. If you think of it as maths or numbers, it will scare, you think of it as a storybook with a beginning and an end and how you craft a story. So that, for me, it's like, whoa. A very good takeaway. So numbers are not just numbers. They tell exactly what is happening in the marketplace, tell you exactly how consumer behavior is like, right.
But other than that, she's really just a workaholic. And when I was in BAT, there was this one department that I didn't, in mention training, I did it as a management trainee. I didn't really excel in, but she gave me a chance. She saw something in me. She said, just give Jing a chance. I think she'll be able to make it again, because it goes back to me being politically unaware.
Nobody teach me, I dunno how to go around. I was very, very blunt, just being myself. But it is not acceptable in a corporate environment. So when I was an area manager or in sales is different because salespeople are just planned. Yes. When you curse each other in front and the next minute you'll just be like, oh bro, just go lunch and go smoke.
They don't take it by heart. But I think in a hq a corporate environment is a totally different thing. Yeah. You're dealing with more professional people.
Ling Yah: Yes.
Hui Jing Lee: Where. Now I understand the political awareness is not asking you to sugarcoat, but just holding back certain words that you can say in a different settings.
Ling Yah: Yeah,
Hui Jing Lee: no, not in front. It's comes with a little bit of respect. So now me as a co-founder and a CEO company, I understand that.
Ling Yah: Yeah.
Hui Jing Lee: Right. Because now I can see it like all my employees. Okay. These are not politically aware.
Ling Yah: You were just like me.
Hui Jing Lee: Yeah. You were just like me. We were in the same club. But I mean, I'm more apologetic to them because I wanted to also know that this is a safe space to express yourself.
Yeah. Yeah. So I think with my manager, her name is Juju by the way.
Ling Yah: Mm.
Hui Jing Lee: Yeah. Why do you think Juju saw you saw in you? I think we have similar backgrounds. She's also not you know, well to do, but she was a fight. She is a fighter. Yeah. She fights for her rights and she gave me this code when I left BET for those who fight for it.
Life has a flavor, the shelter will never know.
Ling Yah: Wow.
Hui Jing Lee: Wow. So yeah, she's always like the, the one person that I look up to. Really? Wow. Yeah. Was
Ling Yah: it hard to leave BAT and Juju as well?
Hui Jing Lee: Juju, I think she was also at the Bring Livy
Ling Yah: that time. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Easy to stay on and easy to stay
Hui Jing Lee: on. But of course there are also many group leaders, but she's the one that really shaped me to who I am today.
Ling Yah: Yeah.
Hui Jing Lee: And
Ling Yah: Yeah, that was some something I didn't understand. Yeah. So when I was first starting, I thought just apply to the most prestigious company. That's the best thing. Yeah. And I go in and go, doesn't matter how prestigious company is, it's
Hui Jing Lee: who you work for. Correct. It's who you work for. So she really saw something in me.
Yeah. She's she sleeps in the office. She shower with a bidet. Oh no. Yeah. But she's very wiser. She's very wise. Yeah. And very non-typical like you would think that. How will you think Juju looks like in your
Ling Yah: own, like Tish hair, like suit? Not even suit. She's not, no. She's now a,
Hui Jing Lee: she's a Malay lady who used to swear a lot, but now she's just in her tudung and everything.
Yeah. That's her. So it is not that, that typical image that we would think that she is. But of course there will be some other people that are like, oh, I don't don't like her leadership style. She's too she working us too hard. She has no limit.
The latest that we worked with her was under 3:00 AM and we have to report back to work at 8:00 AM in the morning.
But I think at the age of 25, it's fine. You don't need to sleep. Yeah. We runs on alcohol or. Oh, just
Ling Yah: endorphin. Yeah. Yeah. He reminds me of my early days, right? Yeah, yeah, yeah. My first ever trial, third month end, last minute, changed everything. Saturday, went home at 4:00 AM came back for 9:00 AM work, and then Sunday didn't go home at the 6:00 AM Mm.
Showered. Took a nap, was in court by eight. Oh my goodness. Thank God for my nine. So that I will forever remember that. And I kind of knew, I don't think I can last year. Yeah. But I didn't have time after work to do anything else yet. You were already starting to sell insurance part-time
Hui Jing Lee: or did you find Okay, so, so after my students with in hq.
So they always see me as like someone who can go out. Right. And of course they have the diversity agenda. So they wanted someone, a female in. Sales, which is what we call field or operations. I know it's always me, so I know that even if I stay on, what's my next career steps, right?
So was that good or bad? It is good, yeah. It is the comfort that I wanted, but then I realized, hey, there's no whole story to tell anymore. Then my story just end. So then I, I'll ask myself, okay, so if I grow old, right? If I wanna write a book about my biography, how do I want my book to be?
So that's why I quit BAT and joined insurance. Wow. Yeah. But of course, before that I was doing insurance for one and a half years. And why I did that was because I met a very bad boss. Mm. Yeah. So this guy was the opposite of everything. Of my was just, yeah. Just not with it. So because it was also a few operations works ends on time because there's no point working late.
We start early, we ends early, so I have a lot of spare time. Yeah. Just wondering what do I do? Do I go to dream and do I, what do I do? Like there's no self-development. Yeah. So then I, my friend who is an insurance agent invited me to the agency. I didn't realize that's actually a trap to ask me to be an insurance agent.
My first class was about MLTA and MRT. Like, wow. Oh, this thing I already taught me before. Okay. Where is the next class? I wanna come again. I didn't know that. This is a lure to lure me into attract, to lure me into signing up, to be an examine and to be an agent for.
A good few months I didn't know. No mention about I'm actually recruiting you to be my agent. None. And I would get a cut. Yeah. None. So then they're like, oh, you know, if you buy insurance you can sell to yourself. Oh yes. Okay. I can. I got time. Right. Then you go, for example. Oh, all right. Then I also put up with that when I didn't even do research.
So sometimes it's a blessing in disguise to not know too much.
Ling Yah: Yeah,
Hui Jing Lee: yeah. Sometimes when we have too much data, we get into analysis paralysis. So with that, it was really by chance I didn't like my day job. Manager. So when I see my night job manager, wow, this inspiring leader or insurance manager was so motivated, talk about dreams, which I never think before, which I never thought of before.
It was a very refreshing settings to be in. And then after doing it part-time, when I speak to my colleague, Hey, you don't have insurance? Hey, you dunno, you're not financially literate because I'll fulfill one of it. This is something that none of our school class actually taught us, right?
Everybody was just think that, well, our insurance, you are another MLM con job, but it's not, it's just a foundation of personal finance. But of course when I really got full-time into it, then I realized it's not easy at all. What did I sign up?
Ling Yah: Why did you go into it full-time when you could apply to another corporate job?
Hui Jing Lee: Again, it was the reason like Kay. My story, just another corporate job. So my biography just ends like Jing continued for another corporate job and you know, climb the career ladder. So it's a typical not so interesting story.
Throwing everything outta the window sounded like an adventure. I wanted that adventure. Because I was just thinking, okay, now I have no commitments. I don't have a family. Yes, I have a house back then, but it's still minimal. If I don't do it, if I don't risk it, I don't really see how is the world outside, when am I gonna do it?
If I go to another corporate job, I don't think I can find someone as good as BAT. Honestly speaking, the culture is great. Right. Other than that bad manager, I love my colleagues. A lot of them are still friends. So I know that if I go to another corporate job, I will not get what I want.
So like, go back to. Like my part-time job, I actually went and became a Mix FM road runners. Right at the back of my mind I was thinking, the reason why, why I did that was because it's not something that I will do after I went into, I go into a full-time job. True enough, I won't go shouting around by the roadside asking people to come and buy, take free gifts from me.
But that was a very good experience as well. So same goes when I quit BAT and going to insurance. I know that, okay, I'm just gonna risk it now. If it didn't work out, I can always still go back, right? Because I have like, what can be worse? Nothing can be worse than what we've been through when we were in a rut during in my childhood.
So I have nothing to lose. So having nothing to lose, I think is the best position. 'cause you can really do everything. It depends on how you see, like a lot of people will see in a more negative lens or I got nothing. But actually when you have nothing, you can go all out.
Ling Yah: Did you have almost a deadline?
Oh, I'm gonna go into insurance maybe just for two years.
Hui Jing Lee: No, I didn't. A lot of my decisions were not planned. Mm. Yeah. So, because I didn't want to get into and not, I'm always not a planner. Even like Bill Villa wasn't, it was unplanned. Yeah. It was also accidental. So yeah. Then when your insurance and it, it was tough.
Yeah. Because I'm always very blunt when you sell. No, I still haven't got the skills of selling. When you sell a plan, you still need to be, very interesting. Tell people, what's the reason. But somehow female customers just don't trust me. Maybe I have a RBS or I'm just too Yeah, too.
Too young. Yes, too young is also one of the reasons.
So they just didn't trust me, but a lot of my ex-colleagues, they trust me 'cause we are from the same line of work. They know how I work and I'm just very theoretical when I ask 'em to sign up something. Unlike a whole bunch of insurance agent in the same industry.
Yeah. That is something that I really didn't like. How there are certain elements of misleading, right. Elements of not disclosing everything. I really didn't like the environment and that is what sort of make me think, okay, what else can I do? I'm already out here, do I wanna go back into corporate?
Maybe not because I enjoy the freedom.
Ling Yah: Yeah. Did it ever cross your mind? I regret choosing insurance. There were months right? Where you didn't make any sales?
Hui Jing Lee: No. I never regretted. Yeah. For me, there's always a reason, something why that events or that incident happened. I never regret that because it also is a very good experience that builds me to who I am today.
Yeah.
Ling Yah: Mm-hmm. And how do you move from insurance to the next thing?
Hui Jing Lee: Okay, so it was also very funny. I have a friend who is also working odd jobs. So he just saw the way his company saw the way his business and he was driving great. He's like aging. I saw this place, what can I open? Say open convenience, dollar, quite easy.
Ling Yah: So that advisor,
Hui Jing Lee: yeah. Yeah. Advice. So this is another company is called e is that's the company start with an E. So I help him to like sort of like advise him or was that advisor for him to start like his convenience store because through my experience at BAT, right there's this customer who has 30 convenience chain and nobody know of it and it's all below condo.
So when my friend saw this location below the condo, that was the first thing I told him. Go and open a convenience store and low barriers of entry is just a trading business. Locate back. So you don't actually need to furnish it very nicely, Don imagine yourself to be like, sale 11, just sell what you need because people will come and his business actually succeeded.
Yeah. And then I told him, Hey, for every single shop you open, you sign a policy with me. That's was our deal. Then after that I thought, hey, why not? I do it myself after I met my husband, because my husband is good with like property. Landlords. So then I say, okay, now we just develop us. You just start our own.
Ling Yah: Did you feel like there would be tension 'cause you're studying a competitor?
Hui Jing Lee: Yes. So, okay. Until today, for some reason we are not talking, but there's nothing between us.
Ling Yah: Really.
Hui Jing Lee: Yeah. There's no rivalry because it's just very different route that we are going. But he always thought that I had something against him, but no.
To me, I think he's still a friend. That gave me a reason to start this. So then we started the company that start with a o
Ling Yah: Yeah. With
Hui Jing Lee: a different different partners.
But I still, at this point in life, I still have self esteem issue.
Ling Yah: Really,
Hui Jing Lee: really, I still have self esteem issue because like when I look at insurance I know I'm good.
I have the knowledge. I'm also very, very hardworking. Why am I not on the stage? Then I look at my network of people. I simply just do not have the network. Whereas some people, some of my friends, they come with network. Maybe it's an introduction from the parents or whatsoever. So I still suffered with self-esteem.
Even at that point in my life.
Ling Yah: Yeah.
Hui Jing Lee: Yeah. So then I didn't ask for a share. It was quite stupid on me. So we set up the company back in 2018. 2019.
And then I was told like, Jing, you talk too much as a female, can you shut up? That is when the famous "ask your husband to feed you".
He can do it. That happens at a bar. I almost want to get into a bar fight. I want to fan toi, yeah. I wanna flip the table. I see. I've never. Even in BAT, like such a huge environment with full of men. I've never gotten anybody who said that to me before. These two fella are the first
Ling Yah: Yeah,
Hui Jing Lee: I was really taken aback, I say at this day and age.
Really? Did I hear wrongly? They really did say that to me. Yeah. How did you understand? So I say you didn't flick the table. I didn't flick the, I didn't flick the table. I chef Danny. I said, yeah, how dare you. How dare you. Right? We built this. Yeah. We were the two of you when we were running the business, and I remember there was this one bread supplier that didn't deliver.
I had to go to a bakery, buy their bread, and I didn't have sleep for the past 24 hours. Yeah, but nevermind. I mean, BilaBila is where it is today because of the
Ling Yah: fire. The fire, yeah, the fire from that moment then that, so you went back to Justin and you said, this is what happened. Let's start our own thing.
Oh, actually
Hui Jing Lee: Ji came, oh, in the story, she saw his, he went to Justin.
Why didn't you include me in your business? Oh, fomo. It's like, we just gonna start our own.
We register a company in December, 2019.
Ling Yah: And it looked like the perfect division in terms of roles as well from GK investment, banking, assessing, has all the Yes.
Property network. Yeah,
Hui Jing Lee: yeah, yeah.
Ling Yah: Almost Like it was meant to be.
Hui Jing Lee: Yeah. Correct. So then I realized partnership is really important. I really didn't have so much expectation whether this will work out. Because the old didn't work out. Right. But I think, is really able to grow today is because we have very good segregation of roles and task, right?
They don't like what I'm doing, I don't like what they're doing either. So that's why we are able to grow so quickly.
Ling Yah: Segregation of roles clear from the start.
Hui Jing Lee: It wasn't, yeah. Yeah. So at first I was still running insurance. I was still an insurance agent. I didn't expect to be doing this full-time 'cause I still need an income.
Ultimately, this is still a startup. Then we hired a gm, right? Then it didn't work out and we realized that you cannot hire someone and help you to become a millionaire. You need to be hands on. And that is when automatically, I'm the one who has to step in because I can. So the good thing about insurance is of the recurring income.
And the recurring income is the key thing where insurance agents go around and recruit other people.
When I started BilaBila only, I really truly understand, wow, this recurring income is such a blessing. I worked so hard for the first two to three years. Now I'm drawing it.
Yeah. So when BilaBila started for the first two years, I didn't take any income. It was just very minimal. About RM 1,500.
But it was okay because a lot of my income is still from insurance.
So then when I am in BI only, I understand that, oh no, I understand why the insurance agent or my manager treat this career like it's a cult.
Serious. Yeah. Because you can literally not work. You still get a five figure. Yeah. It's the oldest form of passive income. Yes. Yes. It's, it's, I mean, again, blessing in disguise, I didn't like it, but because I worked so hard, I became a manager, an agency manager, in a short period of two years. And that is when I get a five figure income while and I can have the comfort to do what I want with blah, blah, blah, blah.
Ling Yah: That explains why LinkedIn still says you're under insurance. Yeah, I am. I'm still an active
Hui Jing Lee: agent. Yeah, I was advice, yeah. Oh really? I'm still actively holding my license because I felt that I still have the responsibility for the customers that trusted me and until today, I really appreciate all of them for helping me to start this entrepreneurship journey.
I felt that there's still a responsibility for me to answer back to them if they have certain claims needs. Of course now I will pass on the work to my admin, right. In insurance, so. Yeah. So
Ling Yah: even though you had the massive income, weren't you scared to go into BilaBila Mart? you've seen your family fail in their business and how bad it can get?
Hui Jing Lee: So the blessing is because I have two other partners Yeah. And they manage to get into, become more shareholders.
That was the plan from the start. Yes. That was, no, actually it was by chance.
Ling Yah: Mm.
Hui Jing Lee: EXIM is a property developer for a lot of condos. Yeah. So the strategy since the beginning of start beginning was to get to be in condo aluminum Right.
To open conventional and condo aluminum.
My husband went to EXIM and said that, we want your locations. Yeah. And then our investor, Mr. Lee, was just say that maybe I just invest in you. Why is that, that everybody wants my location? Why is that so? So then they finally gotten the justifications because.
Our neighborhood, traditional neighborhood needs to be, it used to be horizontally scattered and you always have like 1, 2, 3 sheets. Even so now the neighborhood are all vertically grown. You can have one convenience, saw it justified. Yeah. So that makes sense. Hence our strategy.
Ling Yah: That's how I found out about BilaBila.
Yeah, I can, I always do my groceries and I go, what is this other mart that popped out of nowhere that I've never heard of with this gr greenish blue color? Yeah. And I go between both. 'cause there's also seven 11 beside it and I go, oh, almost same products. Not the same, but wait, you're cheaper. Okay, I'll go to you.
But coming in, bringing in a partner, 35%, that's a big risk. Mm. Was it scary? If the relationship was bad, it would be bad.
Hui Jing Lee: So again, a lot of our decision, all decisions or a lot of steps that we take, we really didn't really think too much about it. Like, okay, gut feel. Wow, this sounds like it can work. Killer that just go off.
But unfortunately our first ever location was open two days before MCO and it's a mall.
It was way out of our strategy.
Mont Kiara.
It was Mont Kiara. That was bad. Two days before MCO we became an inconvenience store. Oh yeah. Because why we opened at the location is because there were like office traffic, but during MCO there was zero traffic. So then we have to sort of like bring the business online.
And then Dettol all saved you. Yeah. Dettol sort of saved us. Oh, did they? You? Yeah. How I mean this, I really have to thank my early on customers that trusted us by buying from us to via direct messaging. So it was like me posting about this, no racks full of that all. And then my first customer like, can you deliver to me?
And remember she stayed in Setiawangsa, this was my first ever customer. And then after that she proceeded asking, do you sell any other things? Then I remember the basket was with munchies biscuits, some other random food, food. Food that we have or Yeah. So there's some other random food that say, Hey, this could work.
So then the next customer who ask us for Dettol, I also will ask them, do you need anything else? We have like food even secrets, right? Yeah. So, then the rest became
I mean the first batch of customers that trusted us through online, these are the people that really give us confidence to build what we have today.
Like Malaysian just have so much trust. What if I just evaporate. And I don't deliver because every single transaction they'll pay in advance, including delivery fee. Some were fulfilled during via la la move. Some were via grab some was via postage. But there are so much trust and confidence.
So now I know why scam calls can happen so easily.
Ling Yah: What would you say is the first big breakthrough for you guys?
Hui Jing Lee: For us, bill was I think the first big breakthrough was when we finally realized when we built the kedai runcit modern hashtag, right? Because when we first started, I was still very hesitant. Do I wanna sell fresh? Do I wanna sell grocery?
It's not something that I envision it to be 'cause I want to be like a hot food, hot food place where sell that we sell Malaysian food. I didn't want to do all the groceries. So I think the breakthrough was when we decided that that should be the direction. Then the rest became history. That's when we gotten a lot of like local produced local brands to be us and then we go together.
Yeah. That was the first breakthrough I would say. 'Cause it helps us to have so much clarity in what we are going to build next.
Ling Yah: Unless you're in retail, you dunno the realities of going to a grocery and seeing that product on the shelf. I didn't know until I started working with some people who started their own artisanal brands.
We have to pay huge listing fees. Just to have a spot. But even then, it wouldn't be at the top shelf. Be at the bottom shelf. What is the reality that most of us consumers don't see? What's the process to get my stuff in?
Hui Jing Lee: Oh, okay. This has been my recent business predicament.
I mean, when we look into really net profits, right? Then we realize, oh. Actually tons of product that we sell that doesn't generate US income.
Ling Yah: Yeah. Most people running your thing. Yeah. They make money
Hui Jing Lee: off the listing. Yes. Yeah. Yeah. So when we look at how much we earn by that's not the real income.
The real income actually come from the back margins so I think that is something that a lot of customers don't see.
But of course there are certain items with higher margins. But it's not as easy as it looks. Because when we first started, our pricing is just, okay, we want to be competitive.
Then recently we realized, oh, we cannot continue to do this anymore. It's either we have to increase our price or make our suppliers pay for it. But I still waive up the same fee from the small suppliers because it's hard. I know it's difficult. Along the way in the past four years, we've seen so many Malaysian brand came and didn't persist.
For whatever reasons, ah.
Ling Yah: And normally these small artisanal brands, they get bad pay masters and they can't afford.
Hui Jing Lee: Yeah, I mean for, for us, I think it really depends on the accounts. But we were try to avoid that. But I'm not sure. I can't say for the others.
Why is it like such a bad pay master? My finance team will just tell me that eh, boss. this one's few thousand Ringgit only. It's fine. Now we pay later, we pay the biggest supplier. I say, wait, this few thousand Ringgit could be a huge amount. It is a huge amount for small enterprise, but your a hundred thousand, 200,000 is actually just a small amount for the biggest suppliers.
You need to pay the small one first. Probably just that few hundred Ringgit or the few thousand Ringgit that needs to keep the lights on for them. Yeah. Then the mindset. The mindset actually shifts.
Ling Yah: But how do you continue to protect the smaller brands or making sure you're still profitable?
It can grow.
Hui Jing Lee: It's a lot of collaboration. I think recently we have a smaller brands coming. The team is very inexperienced. Yes, I am very frustrated with how they are like, but then one of my teammates was just say that, do you see potential in them? One of my staff was, if you see potential in them, you can grow with them.
You teach them because the margin makes sense. And they're willing to learn. Why not? You just teach them to grow up.
So that is some of the effort, the extra effort that we need to put in. For the smaller guys, we will give them some leeways. In terms of like sometimes late deliveries or like certain, packaging quality.
We just have to close one eyes to help them out.
Ling Yah: I know some people who do have their products stored on your shelves as well. They'll like, we get a PO a week ago, give me 300 jars next week. And then we have to frantically prepare it for them. Mm. I wonder, oh, okay. I try. Oh, was it too clear?
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. What's the reality? If I wanna start my own small thing, BilaBila Mart, what does that look like? 'Cause it's a big thing right now I'm on Malaysians, right. I have this little passion, let me start it. Let me try and grow it. Sell it.
Hui Jing Lee: Okay. I mean, we can help you from the front.
But ultimately, whether your product sells, depends on whether consumer interested. So you need to have a very competitive, very nice or very attractive packaging. With information that is sufficient to convince customers to pay the price for it, that the exterior, the aesthetic is the most important.
And then the effort of getting people to try it. I think trying is something that is not so difficult, but rather the repeat purchase.
So it needs to taste good.
Yeah. So all of our staff, mostly all of our staff, but whenever I have a new brand, I will ask all of them to try it first.
If it didn't pass, if any of you say it's not nice, we will not list in even though that it's a small brand that I really wish to support. Because ultimately at the end of the day, I can only help you until this journey of listing whether your product sells or not. You have to convince the customers.
You need to do your part. I can't spoon feed you all the way.
Ling Yah: Have you noticed certain, what are the things that allow a brand to be successful?
Hui Jing Lee: Other than the packaging? It really has to have quality.
The quality need to be consistent. Are there particular, I dunno, brand names that you wanna shout out?
Ling Yah: You don't have to.
Hui Jing Lee: Again, I, I say this brand many times actually while kombucha, I mean, with this brand 'cause it's one of the early starters with us, it was a one man show, and why I was exposed to the brand was because my husband was sick actually. Then I read somewhere, oh, kombucha probiotic. They can help you recover in your sickness whatsoever.
I found it in a vegetarian shop. And I cannot find it anywhere else other than the vegetarian shop, the other channels that are online. But I have a MOQ of six bottles. Mm. But if I, what if I just want one?
So that is why he was one of the first brands that I got. And then today, I think you can see why kombucha collaborating with so many different international brands like Fresh la, they were also in other bigger retail chain.
So he is one of like the brands that has been starting with us and his quality has been consistent ever since the weather. This is a bottling his marketing effort. It has been very consistent. Whereas we see some brands, like they started off rah rah rah then after that there's no news anymore.
There's no consistency in terms of marketing. Nothing much has been done for the brand. No new products. So I think with, while they themselves also know very clear where the directions need to be. So they continue to grow, continue to collab. So that is one of like the good brands that I've seen grown over the years and I'm very proud of it.
Ling Yah: During my research. I went on LinkedIn and I found this LinkedIn post by Brian Te assisted. Is it the operations manager. And you mentioned you and how he really enjoyed his time, the family and culture you have instilled at Bila-Bila Mart. And the moment I saw the word family, it made me think of a question I asked.
Mm. Pretty much everyone including Venon just now. Mm. It started first with Mr. Money. Peter Young. Mm.
Because the first thing he told me when I first met him, he was like, I tell all my staff I'm not your father. And then when I interviewed Ping Yong of Good Foodie, he basically, I told him this and I said, the way you speak doesn't sound like you agree with Peter.
And he went, yeah, I'm their father. How do you see that?
Hui Jing Lee: Okay. When I first started.
I was very, very personal over personal with my staff. Good and bad. The good one I appreciate. But there are some that will take advantage. Yes. They take advantage of your kindness, your empathy.
To ensure I work. Just betray your trust. Love. This is also the hard way of learning. Then we realize, okay, yes. As much as I want this to be family, like the line need to be clear.
I will empathize with you of why you didn't come to work today. But work is still work.
Mm-hmm. I still need to be very fair with my other team members. So when it first started, I was a lot more, if I wanna go into Myers Briggs, I was very f
Ling Yah: yeah.
Hui Jing Lee: I was always the far f
Ling Yah: Oh, that's tough. As
Hui Jing Lee: a boss. Yes. Then recently I'm gonna redo the test again. I'm already a TI can, I can truly understand that because like what I told you just now, I mean now I would just have to say that like, okay, today I'm just not feeling it.
I need to prioritize my work today. So there is a lot more courage to do with my feelings currently, and I know that I cannot let the feelings overtake how I run the business. So now I think I can cut the line.
That's a clear line. I know how to not care about certain things.
Yes, I empathize with you, but I cannot let it affect me. So it has
Ling Yah: kind of draw again from Veon 'cause his interview is still fresh about team culture and I was telling him, I came across this interview where you said, I used to think team culture is bullshit and think he changed his mind. Mm.
How do you think about team culture?
Hui Jing Lee: It's the most important, right? Because of where I come from again, goes back to BATI mean that is the first workplace that really I appreciate.
. I'm not so sure about now, but when I was there really is one of the best. Yeah. Our colleagues become friends and why we are able to grow.
It was one of the most prestigious pergo company to be is because of how synergistic the team is.
Team culture to me has always been the key as an area manager last time, my team right can work with me without OT until one to 2:00 AM. Because we just enjoy working together. And I know even though it's very hard, but they'll just find ways or conviction to be the part of the activity that we're going And it's work now.
We go talk to consumers while you need to try this. New secrets. It's a gray area. Yeah. We're not supposed to do this, but we are not being paid ot because there's a competition and everybody went all out to win the competition. And in my year we won so many competition like consumer conversions, competitions, and so many others that I don't remember.
But I was area manager back then, so it's something that I really take a lot of pride on. 'cause I was like, oh my God, how did I do this until like this bunch of older men. I convinced to work with me. Yeah. I think probably. A lot of other leaders, they were just like, okay, you go and do this. They were just instruct.
But for me, my way of leadership has always been, I will do it. Then it's up to you whether you wanna follow, I'll show you how to do it. So if cleaning shelves, I'll be the one who clean the shelves driving the van out to replenish stocks. I'll be the one who do it.
So probably that is why the team is convinced because they know that I don't just instruct them to do, but I'm also in it with them.
Ling Yah: Especially at some point, you must have realized there are only so many hours in a day I can't be driving the van. Yeah. Correct. So how does the role evolves over time
Hui Jing Lee: in Right.
Definitely with more and more people, I have to hire someone to, yeah. Do that. But I still enjoy doing it.
Ling Yah: Mm.
Hui Jing Lee: Right. If you are to ask me to go and drive the van and deliver stocks today, I will still do it because it's a different lens that I see. Yeah. What is actually happening.
Ling Yah: Yes.
Hui Jing Lee: But I really truly understand your business to get hands on.
Ling Yah: Yeah. Some CEO do that, right. Like every now and then they take one day out. Even Anthony and Human go around and just deliver goods in different countries. See what it's like.
Hui Jing Lee: Yeah. Yeah. So as do not doing, like whether it's merchandising or being a cashier. Yeah.
Ling Yah: One of the most interesting things about you is that, is that you have a big team, but they're very young, mostly female, and they must create a very interesting position.
For you as a leader, what is it like to lead this team?
Hui Jing Lee: Oh, you are new juvenile. Yeah, I'm new juvenile. So very interesting because these are the gen.
Ling Yah: Yeah.
Hui Jing Lee: So I'm actually learning a lot from them.
Ling Yah: Yeah.
Hui Jing Lee: Like how creative they are, how resourceful they are, and how they use technology to ease their work.
Then I realize a lot of them use church busy. Oh
Ling Yah: yeah. At their work they're coming out. Yeah. But I mean, if you're smart about how to use it. Yeah, yeah,
Hui Jing Lee: yeah. It helps. Like you can just paraphrase it, but I mean, it's not a bad thing. No. You are just saving time.
Ling Yah: Yeah.
Hui Jing Lee: And if you don't do it, someone else will, you'll be left behind.
Correct. Correct. It's a very different way of Yeah. Working or leadership to inspire these people.
Ling Yah: What were some of the things where your team went, you should do this, and you thought, I feel I'm too old to do this. TikTok videos.
Hui Jing Lee: Oh, he asked me to do a dance. I'm like, can I just fly behind? Don't include me.
I was asked to do it like, oh boss, you're doing a it alone. No way. I'm not gonna do this. Please. This is something that I still cannot, like TikTok dancers. Yeah. Not something that we will do. You can do. So demure. Very
Ling Yah: mindful, very demure. That's more acceptable reality.
Hui Jing Lee: I'm still, I'm still very I'm, I will be very aware of what is happening.
I'll scroll. Yeah. Doom scroll. TikTok Instagram, but no way. No, no. I cannot dance. TikTok dance. No. Something that, yeah, I will do it if I needed to, but please not. The light. Like, no, that one will escape everything. Yeah. So also a funny story. We, because of this Gen Z, our team building was in like this escape a ho.
Ling Yah: Wow.
Hui Jing Lee: Yeah. Then I forgot that I already delivered two kids and I'm no longer active, like how I used to. Oh, no. It was bad breaking for me. Yeah. So like, okay, we're not that old, but you know, we're no, no longer 25. Yeah. So these are the things which I think getting out of our comfort zone to, to get ourself into it is it's also a learning stage every day we're learning.
Ling Yah: And then there's also the harder side as well, because it's fun to figure out how to work together, but you meet the more traditional, older people. Mm. I imagine they'll look at your team and go, who are you? You're female and you're young, you don't know anything. Mm. Do you face that kind of discrimination?
Hui Jing Lee: If I'm around, no. Mm. But if they're just by themself, they'll come back to me and say, they're like, oh. Some people ask them, oh, what are you, which level are. Some of them get asked this question like, oh, why is this actually relevant?
There are still very chauvinistic men that will question my team's capability based on, by looking at their outlook, thinking that you are young, you are female, you don't know much.
Unfortunately, there are still some people who are like that. What's your advice for them? Social. Just be yourself. I mean, it will get easier. Yeah. It will really get easier when you grow older. Yeah. Don't try to hard to prove because it'll not work. Be confident that you are not what they label you as.
Yeah.
Ling Yah: Do you feel more confident?
Hui Jing Lee: Definitely. Yeah. Yeah, definitely.
Where was that turning point?
Honestly, I think the turning point when was when my father passed away.
So it is just like wow. A sigh of relief because during the tail end of his life, he's still owing money. So that really didn't gimme a peace of mind, like, okay, if I am to get up to a certain career or like a certain status, if he is to come and jeopardize them, what happened?
So I went all out and I'm able to go all out mentally and also physically was when he's gone.
'Cause it's like a time bomb. My mom always call him a time bomb. Yeah. Mm. Your mother must be proud of him or questioning what you're doing. My mom, she has never questioned me.
She's always been the parent, although she's a teacher. But I was just telling my team I don't know how as a mother, because I'm a mother now she can let me party at Zouk under 5:00 AM on Friday and Saturday and sleeping very soundly.
Ling Yah: Oh wow. Yeah. And this is not Singapore. There's
Hui Jing Lee: not Singapore.
Back then. We don't even have grab. It was taxi, but most of the time I was driving. I don't know how she has that trust in me.
I mean, because of that freedom that she has given me also because she doesn't have really have the time.
It builds me to who I am. So I think she has always been able to trust me now. It's a blessing in disguise.
Ling Yah: Speaking of mothers, you have kids as well. When we were setting this up, you would text me at 3:00 AM and tell me this is normal for you. How do you find that balance?
Hui Jing Lee: So why I texted you at 3:00 AM Because I put them to sleep at about 10 30 and most of the time I'll fall asleep.
I wake up at two. Oh no. And I'll be like, no, that's where all my, where's my personal time? So I thought, boss, I will get up. Whether I will dooms draw or Netflix or whatsoever. I just want to have my own time. All clearing out all my WhatsApp messages that I couldn't in the morning or some of my emails.
So then I'll do that under 5:00 AM and go back to sleep again.
Ling Yah: But how do you figure out, 'cause it, both girls are so time consuming. In fact mother, that's even more time consuming. Mm. You're responsible for an entire human being.
Hui Jing Lee: Yeah. I wouldn't say that I'm a role model mother.
With my first son I was a little bit more stringent. Like, okay, I needed him to eat a certain diet, no screen time. But after a while, you just have to let it go for your own sanity. And don't care about other people's judgment law.
Last time I used to judge, ah, you are letting your kids watch the screen.
But I realize I just want to have peaceful meal. Screen or no screen. There needs to be a certain regulations, in moderation, but don't make it too hard for yourself.
Society can be judgmental. That's the issue, but always prioritize yourself first. So how I juggle, I send her to daycare.
My second child, I sent him when he was three months old.
Then of course there will be a lot of like parents or family who will give opinions like, oh, you can send your kids to school so early. You should leave their home. Why didn't you take care of them yourself? You have all the freedom.
I mean, what makes you think that your kids doesn't want to have space from you? They also wanna have their own time. And I look at my two kids today, they are just one and half and two and a half. They are very good at social skills.
They see everybody outside that. They'll say hi. I'm not sure if that's a good thing because they'll say hi to strangers as well, but I mean,
Ling Yah: sometimes they don't follow them back home.
Hui Jing Lee: But I mean the social skills itself for me is very important. If you're at home, then I'm not sure how they will be like, yeah. But again, I need to have my own career. They also have their own space. They can be with their own friends, so don't get bothered by society judgment. But over the weekends my time is a hundred percent for them.
So when I'm with them every time after school pick up from seven to 10, it is a hundred percent even I will be away from my phone. So I'm a hundred percent in everything that I do, whether it is work, I'll be a hundred percent. At home. I'll be a hundred percent. So that is how I compensate myself.
For the mom, guilt for sending them to school or like the loss of time for seeing them, of seeing them grow at home. Yeah. So I really salute the stay at home moms Yeah. For doing, sort of sacrificing it all for their kids.
Ling Yah: What do you see in the future that's coming for you and
Hui Jing Lee: Honestly for now we look at growing the outlet up to a hundred.
Yeah. First, because now at 10 outlets is a different hurdle. Yes. At 20 is a different one. And now at 50 it is also a different one. So I can't imagine what will be my next obstacles or my next challenges coming when it's coming to a hundred. So for now we'll focus on that and going to IPO.
So whatever that we're doing now is in compliant to what IPO should have.
Ling Yah: Why IPO? That's a whole level of stakeholder management involved.
Hui Jing Lee: For me personally, it's for legacy planning easier. Personally, but of course my stakeholders have some, of course financial reasons will be, fundraising and whatsoever instead of like taking loans or other ways.
So that is of course the business purpose. But for me, I mean, it's easier to plan out legacy.
Ling Yah: For listeners, what can you do to help you?
Hui Jing Lee: Visit my store right over everyone's house. Let me know. Really? We really appreciate honest feedbacks. You know what how's my staff customer service, the cleanliness of my outlet?
How's my assortment? The pricing? Because the last thing that we want to be is to be complacent and being complacent is a danger. So I'm very uncomfortable being complacent. That is also why I am who I am, why I stepped out bt I did insurance. Why step by insurance and did something else because I'm so afraid of complacency.
There must always be like a self-development, like you must always be constantly learning new stuff. So same goals for Bila-Bila as well. Yes, we are being recognized as the mart in the condo, but what else can we do to be better?
To be like the top five convenience chain in Malaysia.
Ling Yah: I think that's the thing I love most about your story, and I noticed it's very similar to so many successful people, which is you don't have a victim mentality of, oh, poor me, I didn't have this. It's very much just, I want this, I'm just gonna go for it. Mm. I think there's one person who said that what they learned from you is just that you have a just do it spirit.
Mm. If, and you've done so many things as well. If someone knew were to come in and say, who are you Hui Jing, how would you answer? I would say
Hui Jing Lee: that I'm an explorer. I like adventures. I'm a realistic girl. So I like to be a good storyteller. Yes. I want my story to inspire my team, right? My family, and also the female that out there. I mean, my story has been with me for many, many years. And I didn't have the courage to share it.
When I started to share. Then I realized, oh, there are a lot of people who are also in the same kind of situation.
But get yourself outta the situation.
Instead of, like you said, having the victim mindset, complaining that, oh, why this happened to me?
Let fate take over. You are the decision maker of your fate.
Ling Yah: I like that you mentioned that, because I did notice you say before when you first started b. Do you wanna put your story out there? Yeah. I didn't, I always You everywhere.
Hui Jing Lee: Yeah. I really didn't want to because I didn't want, I, I actually don't like to be in a limelight.
Because I thought, okay, I still wanna have my personal time. But then I realized that ehh Mm, it's a very TVB drama story, childhood that I think it's worth sharing.
Ling Yah: Yeah.
Hui Jing Lee: Yeah. To, because when it all goes back to, why you started this business, why I do what I do.
Why am I who I am? It really goes back to the childhood that I had.
I never blame my father. Now that I, look back and because of that, I have my resilience. I'm determined. I used to, yes. Resenting and my mother a lot. Like, why am I like that? Teenager ma.
Course, a lot of hormones that are unsettled, but now that are more experienced in life that I realize actually it's all there's a reason why all this..
Ling Yah: Is there one thing you wish people would know about what your staff is doing?
Hui Jing Lee: What my staff is doing, I think everybody is trying very, very hard.
Everybody who stays on and who has stayed in the company today trusted that the business can go far. That's why everybody's working very hard.
If you are not happy with certain things that we do, just know that we really care.
Let us know. Not trying to ask you to be more forgiving, but you don't just let us know how we can improve.
Ling Yah: And as we close, what kind of legacy do you wanna leave behind?
Hui Jing Lee: I always have this passion in building the next generation, whether it is like the next leaders. So I wish that my story will be able to inspire those who are in hard shape, right?
That don't give up. Whatever that you are seeing, whatever the situation that you're in today happens for a reason is just a pivoting point for you to go to the next level, right? Every single valley is, there's an uphill right in front of you. So that's I would say the legacy that I want to leave to the next generation.
Ling Yah: Do you think you're successful?
Hui Jing Lee: How do you define that? No, not yet. Can be better. This is just like maybe the first a hundred meters of a 42 ki kilometer race. It's still a long journey to go.
Ling Yah: How would you define success?
Hui Jing Lee: When I'm able to replicate another person like myself to take over this business.
Mm. Yeah. Make yourself obsolete. Yeah. Make myself obsolete. Yeah. I shouldn't be indispensable. There should be someone who is good enough to take over and bring Bila-Bila Mart to the next level.
Ling Yah: So what do you think are the most important qualities of a successful person?
Hui Jing Lee: As much as a lot of business person don't, business people don't agree with this, you need to have empathy.
Whether you show it via work or not, you need to understand the reason why certain people are doing what they're doing. I think when it comes to business, there are a lot of cultural businessmen. I mean, you can only go so far. Ultimately, it's your people that can bring you to next level.
So have empathy be resilient. I think that's the, the thing that I would say.
For me, who I am today.
Ling Yah: And where can people find out what you are doing? What Bila-Bila Mart is doing? You are kindly sponsoring this.
Hui Jing Lee: Okay. I'm still pretty much a very private person, so my IG and Facebook is still very private, but find it.
But if you want to know more about me and my team, definitely the Bila-Bila Mart. Instagram. Facebook and TikTok. But you won't be done TikTok. I won't be dancing. No, no. You'll see one video if you scroll back now they will see one video with me, like hiding at the back.
Yeah. The only one.
Ling Yah: Yeah, it's the only one. It's okay. I mean, we've seen like Duolingo, right? Mm. You just need a green bird, so maybe you just need someone in a costume. Yeah. So anything else before we close?
Hui Jing Lee: I really thank all my, I really want to thank my team for sticking it through with me. We are actually still a small brand. We're still an SME.
I appreciate the talents that comes through our doors and is willing to put in their time, most of their time in building this business to see the vision that we see. So I really wanna thank my team for that. And also my customers, the first batch of customers that actually bought things from us online.
Like Dettol. Yeah. Like Dettol. We are not a nobody. We were a nobody. But they trusted us. Yeah. And some of them are still our Instagram forward, so, so I really want to thank all my customers. Amazing. Yeah. Because of them really. We are who we are today.
Ling Yah: Amazing. Mm-hmm.
Thank you Bila-Bila Mart for sponsoring this episode. If you'd like to partner with STIMY to bring more inspiring stories to the world, just drop me an email at sothisismywhy@gmail.com We are always open to potential
collaboration.
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